Could somebody simplify the convo we had with sandrone at the end of Nod-Krai act 4?
I knew that Alain guillotine was the guy who laid the groundwork for Fontaine's clockwork automatons and that Jakob is an immortal abyss corrupted human thing but everything else was just so confusing. I have so many questions.
1. Who the fuck is Rene?
2. What did he do and why Alain friendship with him ended?
3. What happened to alain's friends and family? What was that tragic incident?
4. Why was there a Oceanid and Hydro tulpa in the background?
5. What is the incident that changed Alain , rene and Jakob? Is it the global cataclysm triggered by the five sinners? What exactly happened in Fontaine and how did it impact those 3 guys?
6. What is the whole thing about saving the world which corrupted rene and later effected alain? Is it the prophecy flood in Fontaine AQ but there is no mention of some rene guy doing something to save Fontaine?
7. What exactly happened to alain, rene and Jakob? Ik that Jakob is still alive.
8. Backstory of whatever is that Narzz..thing?
9. Not directly related but what are jakob's goals ?
Commentaires
None of the other archon quests have the requirements of needing you to play a obscure world quest to understand them.
Anyways, here take [this](https://youtu.be/3022fhGGJLc?si=mYca3XOSxpGv82k9), 1 hour of Narzissenkreuz lore, better than any explanation you could get on reddit.
Also, while books can be used to expand a world, they shouldn't be mandatory to understand the main story.
Everything else is relevant only for Sandrone's own background which is not "the main story", and you can bet it's gonna be even more developed on 6.7 or so.
Also if you think no other archon quest had bits and pieces explained in world quests, and obscure texts, you're missing lore from way back in 1.0
Sandadrone is still a relevant side character who is playing a important role in the main story, their background information is important for characterization of sandrone, without it sandrone feels like a plot device. We are told background information regarding nefer, lauma and flins and inturn they are better characterized. Now, Ik that every character being well- characterized is not possible but this is something that the hoyo as a billion dollar company could have easily solved by just having a pop up window saying it is better to do x quest before y quest.
You're trying to make it look like a storytelling issue when in reality it's just a lore skipper issue, and there's no need to play genshin 24/7 to understand these stuff, the things you asked will be explained again if they're relevant at some point such as Sandrone's personal quest, and whatever is left out, if anything will be left out, is present in the world quest and texts that you can read, rewatch, play, or anything that you like more, at your own pace.
And btw iirc both Sandrone and Arlechino pretty much said: it's in Fontaine go do the quest lmao, the game did what you asked, you just didn't pay attention
Their characterization didn't require you to get out of main story and play some obscure world quest.
Sandrone not being playable doesn't excuse the devs to not put the same amount of attention on her when there are playable 5 stars whose characterization is subpar. I mean she has a unique model and is one of the fatui harbingers. They should have either integrated sandrone's background into the main story or at the bare minimum told the players to play the world questline before nod krai story.
Expecting the players to go out of their way to learn lore which isn't included in the main story so they appreciate a plot relevant character more is lazy storytelling.
To explain in a analogy like nahida would, imagine if a installment in a movie series required the audience to learn some obscure lore in a book series or tv show to understand what was happening onscreen this is essentially that.
The things I asked weren't explained at all in the main story, the game just assumed that you did those quests and gives information again assuming you played that quest. I was more confused and pulled out of the story instead of being pulled in.
And before you say that the answers were in the world quests and some obscure readables, my problem is that the game doesn't tell you these things (I acknowledge that they were present in the game). I have already said that the that bare minimum work that the devs could have done is telling the players to play those exact quests before the main story. There are so, so many world quests how am I the player supposed to know that I have to play a specific world quest to understand a part of the world quests.
The previous archon quests didn't assume you played a specific world quest before they give u information. In the previous cases, the world quests expand on pre-existing information, in this case the world quest is the bare minimum to understand the given information. Very different cases
Also , I don't remember sandrone and arlecchino telling you what naza ordo, institute are and who are rene, jakob and what happened to them. Who the oceanid and hydro tulpa in the background are? In the other words, the basic foundational information (the answers to my question) required to understand the fontaine lore weren't included in the quest.
its a Fontaine questline
no point asking here
go do that
separately. i recommended doing the quests rather than asking for the lore
1. Aqueous Tidemarks
2.a Ann of the Narzissenkreuz
2.b Ancient Colors
2.c Unfinished Comedy
3. In the Wake of Narcissus
4. Book of Esoteric Revelations
5. Through the Looking Glass
In that order, though you can do 2.a, 2.b, and 2.c in the order you want just after 1 and before 3. She gives an extremely condensed summary of everything in those quests, so answering your questions is simply: Play those quests. There's A LOT of lore there.
>!1) René de Petrichor was a member of the Narzissenkreuz Ordo, some kind of secret society that was active around 400 years ago, in which several members tried to find a solution to avert the prophecy of Fontaine. The guy was pretty much a genius, we're talking superior intellect, even as a child, to the point of being the first to figure out the cyclical nature of Teyvat (he mentioned Natlantea, Hyperborea and lots of interesting stuff in his notes). He also went to Khaenri'ah, Remuria, Dragonspine, the Chasm and other very important places for his research.!<
>!2) Thanks to a complex equation he invented (the world formula), René managed to predict that Teyvat would come to a brutal and inevitable end, no matter what measures were taken. He had also theorized the existence of the Descenders, and their role as a possible solution (the so-called external "variable") to this problem, which ultimately would turn out to be completely true, but in the absence of such an element in his time, he instead bet on the primordial sea, wishing to dissolve the bodies of the entire nation in order to merge the consciousnesses of everyone, creating some kind of superbeing that would survive the apocalypse. On the way, he willingly dissolved people into the primordial sea, experimented on former friends (including Jakob, a friend of theirs, transforming him into a “neohuman”), and committed a whole host of horrible acts, always with the aim of finding a way to escape the pre-programmed end. Alain, on the other hand, was focused on advances in clockwork mechanics and did not really agree with René's extreme ideas. As a result, they both went their own ways.!<
>!3) At some point, Fontaine branded the Ordo as criminals. Alain's sister (Mary-Ann) became a member of the Maréchaussée Phantom (a special investigation unit), which led her to investigate René and Jakob who were collecting materials inside Elynas, to feed and strengthen the new body of Jakob. Through a sad turn of events, the members of the Order clashed with those of the Maréchaussée inside the calcified body of the beast, resulting in a huge explosion. Mary-Ann died that day, and her memories were absorbed by an Oceanid who accompanied René and Jakob; Lyris.!<
>!4) That would be Lyris (the Oceanid) and the Master (the result of René dissolving himself into the Primordial Sea and absorbing other people to form a super consciousness able to survive the apocalypse - It kind of looks like a dark purple Hydro Tulpa)!<
>!5) I pretty much covered that already, so I'll just add that after this event, Alain more or less isolated himself in his workshop, abandoning all social life. Towards the end of his days, he built Sandrone ("Marionnette", note the similarity in sound to "Mary-Ann"), giving her not only his sister's name and appearance, but also a module that allowed her to have feelings. The last AQ reveals that he always felt guilty about this decision and did everything he could to ensure that Sandrone could live her own life and develop her own personality, without ever having to become a mere clone of Mary-Ann. The fate of René, Jakob, and Lyris is explained in the Ordo quest.!<
>!6) Covered that as well. The reason why you never hear about them in Fontaine's AQ, is because René's first attempt at creating the superbeing failed. I won't go over all the details because it's kind of complicated, but just know that while we were working on our side, Jakob was collecting materials to resurrect/reawaken René.!<
>!7) See 5.!<
>!8) It's very complicated, these guys were weird and the quest really dives into super obscure stuff, that's all I can tell you. They lived in a huge tower that you can visit in the game, but when they were children, they ended up living in an orphanage that is now submerged under the sea. Basically, René, Jakob, Mary-Ann and Alain were all friend when they were kids, and then all the Ordo stuff happened.!<
>!9) See 6.!<
What is this cyclical nature of tevyat.
What happened to rene and lyris?
Ik that jakob is still hanging around because I have done the mamere quest.
As for your questions; >!among the things René theorized is what's known as the “Root Cycle.” The name refers to obscure concepts found in theosophy, the idea being that there are several elemental eras that follow one another as Teyvat evolves over time. These eras are described in the lore of the elemental crowns (*Prayer for Wisdom*, *Prayer for Illumination*, etc.), which reference periods defined by major climatic upheavals such as floods or ice ages. René not only identified these cycles with remarkable precision, but also named them: Hyperborea (Cryo), Natlantea (Pyro), Remuria (Hydro), and Khraun-Arya (Electro).!<
>!Additional support for this theory comes from the Goblet of Eonothem, the cup-shaped piece among the five artifacts. "Eonothem" is a term used in stratigraphy, the science that studies the succession of different geological strata. In our real world, there are 4 "layers" (for 4 ages/eons) and Teyvat appears to mirror this structure, exhibiting four elemental cycles, each closely associated with a dominant element. This interpretation may also explain a notable gameplay detail: Goblets of Eonothem are the only artifact pieces capable of directly increasing elemental damage, reinforcing the idea.!<
>!Both the Root Cycle and the elemental crowns worn by ancient priests describe these eras, but the crowns themselves seem to establish a specific sequence: first an age of fire, followed by water, then lightning, and finally frost. Notably, the Pyro Crown opens by mentioning the thawing of ice, a detail that strongly suggests a cyclical model, in which one era emerges from the remnants of the previous one. Thus, René was the first to truly call it a cycle.!<
>!Finally, regarding the fate of Lyris, René, and Jakob... I strongly recommend that you complete this quest. As I said, it goes quite deep and constantly refers to obscure and complicated things, but it is enlightening to say the least, because René was far ahead of his time. The one with Mamere was one of the first steps.!<